Clitheroe Royal Grammar School

Dan - that is quite encouraging - a school that still has showers after p.e. Your son will only find that humiliating if he has been told it will be. If you are supportive and positive and point out that all the boys will be in the same position he might find it less of a problem. Most boys were a little apprehensive at first but after a few times thought nothing of it. If you arrange for your son not to take showers when the other boys do won't that cause him humiliation?

"Child protection" should really concentrate on actual dangers and should not be used as an excuse to get out of something you are not too keen on.

son moving up to middle school next year and having read the school brochure, saw it said about having showers after PE.
I can't believe (from my own experience) that they still subject chidlren to the misery of standing naked in a school shower with no curtains.

Can the school make the chidlren have showers after PE? I would have thought not due to child protection issues but not sure. Anyone know and anyone told the school that their child won't be having humiliating, naked showers after PE sad.

I'm late into this discussion but thought I'd add my experience. I went to an all boys prep school in Surrey from aged 9. Pe kit was shorts and white t shirt and black pump style plimsolls. Often we played games in and outside and one half would be topless as the skins team even when cold.

Our swim lessons were naked. At 13 you went up to the big school and were allowed trunks, if you forgot them it was naked and a spanking on the side of the pool from Sir with plimsoll. Designed I suppose to make sure you didn't forget again. Happened quite regularly though. For me twice, first time I was so worried as our lesson was late afternoon no time to go home but also no one to borrow a pair. Quite humiliating.

At the start of yr7 I think we were all an shocked about what we had to wear for PE that we all just got on with it. Later it became clear that for some girls, going topless was quite tough. I didn't really need a bra at that age but it still felt quite exposing to have to run around the gym with my chest bare, especially if a boy came in to get something from the store cupboard, or if we had a male teacher covering the lesson.

I think it was logical to wear the minimum clothing for PE to let the body breathe.
Unfortunately we have gone to the other extreme today of boys and girls doing PE in a full tracksuit in many schools. They don't even have showers after PE.
I think the "politically correct" society of today with its pedophile scare and multiculturalism have taken things too far.
I have recently been reading about public swimming pools in Sweden who are making separate swimming times for males and females to accomodate their large Muslim population culture. I wonder if this is also happening in some places in Britain.

Hi Hayley,

I'm glad we didn't have the same rules in our secondary school! Although I didn't start to wear a bra until the start of my second year, towards the end of the first year I was self conscious enough not to want my dad to see me without at least a vest on, let alone a male teacher!

Tim, We may have worn briefs in the late fifties and early sixties, but as you mentioned last month on the Burnley Grammar School site, when we changed for P.E.we had to wear gym shorts with nothing underneath,no shirt and plimsolls, so we were without any support from our underpants which weren't allowed in the interests of hygiene. After working up a sweat in the gym it was a pleasure to take our shorts off and all get under the showers together.

It seems incredible now that not so long ago year 7 (both male & female) had to do PE in just underwear especially as most boys would wear boxers and not the briefs like we used to wear
and which gave much more support.

Year 7 was ages 11-12. I guess that was quite old to have to do our lessons in just our knickers, but that was how it was and we didn't really question it.

It was a mixed school but PE lessons were done single sex. The boys has a similar rule and in year 7 had to do it in their underpants. Although our regular PE teacher was female, a few times we had a male teacher cover the lesson. That didn't alter what we wore (or what we didn't wear!).

Hi Hayley,
We had up to year 5 in primary and then Form 1 to Form 6 in secondary back in the 60s, so I assume that year 7 would have been age 12 or 13 which I think was a bit too old to do PE in just underwear. Even more so since you are talking about the 90s.

Was this a girls school, and if not what were boys made to wear for PE?
Did you ever have male teachers when you did PE in just knickers?

Hi Hayley,
I would imagine that for some, running around topless towards the end of year 7 must have been uncomfortable and embarrassing? Was it an all girls school, or mixed?

Our indoor PE kit was the same for all years at Secondary school - navy blue gym knickers and a white aertex shirt.

Our PE teacher had a rather different attitude to bras than yours; far from forbidding them to be worn, she would sometimes 'suggest' that it was time that certain girls started to wear one!

RobinC,

I agree with you that it would have depended on different factors whether swimming without trunks would have been enjoyable, or no big deal, or whether it would have been humiliating as in your case.

At what ages and under what circumstances were you made to take swim lessons nude at your school?
Was it private or public school and was it mixed or boys only?

Can you mention the factors which made your swimming lessons so embarrassing or degrading at your school?

Wow, so many posts! I've not read them all but I thought I'd add my own. My secondary school was pretty old fashioned when it came to PE and what we had to wear for it. I was there in the 1990s. We did lots of gymnastics rather than things like dance and circuits that are popular now.

Our PE kit changes as we went through the school. In the top two years we had gym knickers and aertex tops. In yr8 we had to do it in gym knickers and a white vest. But on yr7 we weren't allowed PE kit and had to do it in our underwear. What was worse though was that when the teachers said u derqear, they meant just our knickers. We weren't allowed for wear bras or anything else on top!

I've read Marshall's post and I also did swimming lessons without trunks but my experience of it was a lot different. None of us thought it was normal and we weren't comfortable with it overall. I think it's fair to say that Marshall's experience doesn't represent everyone who did swimming lessons at school without trunks. I think it depends on different factors.

Marshall's post made me think of my friend in junior school who rarely wore a shirt at home. His parents, as I recall, felt it was much healthier for their sons to go shirtless as much as possible, and when I went round to their house the boys were usually in just shorts.
When we moved up to senior school we suddenly learned that the boys' PE kit did not include a top of any description! This was quite a shock for most of us boys, who just weren't used to displaying our chests in public (other than while swimming). Not so for my friend, who was perfectly comfortable in shorts only, and couldn't understand why the rest of us were making a fuss!

Gerald you're right about most of us being shirtless at home. That's why we found doing PE shirtless perfectly normal. These days a lot of boys wear full pyjamas even in the summer. Clearly that will cause them to be more replied by shirtless pe

My last sentence should have read "but certainly not those ridiculous almost ankle length board shorts or whatever they call them that youths wear today."

So replace knee length with ankle length to avoid misunderstanding.

Alf
I totally agree with you!

It seems funny how fashion changes and regresses.
Up to the 80s or 90s most youths wore speedos while older gents wore trunks or shorts.
It was actually strange or laughable to see boys and youths wearing long shorts and few did.
Now it is the opposite.
I guess that the older gents are used to wearing speedos from their youth.
Today I actually take the middle road and wear shorts above the knee, but certainly not those ridiculous almost knee length board shorts or whatever they call them that youths wear today.

The difference is that the bikini is fashionable whereas the speedo is simply just not. Board shorts are fashionable, bikinis are fashionable but honestly it's pretty clear that speedos just are a bit too much. It's not something we want to see on the beach. I've only worn them when necessary in swimming competitions.

I agree with Marshall. Ladies of all shapes and sizes seem to be wearing smaller & smaller bikinis on the beach and often they are not flattering and leave quite a lot of flesh exposed.. However, if men dare to wear brief trunks eg Speedos
( and again I agree that sometimes they also are not flattering) people think it is wrong. Where is the equality in that?

Marshall's post really sums it up. I've seen posts before on here about shirtless pe being unfair. At the end of the day, like Marshall said about swimming, we always considered being shirtless to be the standard kit for PE. As well as this, most of us were shirtless at home anyway so it wasn't seen as something unusual to not be wearing a shirt.

I find it quite interesting how over the years men in this country have become more prudish and started to cover up more, from nude swimming to speedos to large board shorts. Meanwhile, women have gone the other way- from almost fully covering swimsuits to bikinis.

Speedos are supposed to be for swimming in my view, not for just walking around in the beach. Board shorts would be better for the beach. The main advantage of swim briefs is how streamlined they are. It always makes me cringe a bit seeing middle aged men wearing them on the beach. It's not something anyone wants to see to be honest.

Marshall, I suppose I have been looking at it from the wrong perspective. Although wearing briefs does make one more streamlined and improves swimming performance compared to doing swimming in the nude.

Nowadays it seems brief type swimming trunks (Speedos) are reserved for serious swimmers. At least I can feel comfortable wearing them abroad where they are more commonly seen.

Back Marshall all the way .. in my day quite normal ... never batted an eyelid!

I know for the younger generation it would seem horrendous to swim without trunks, for us it was what we always thought was the norm. Just like we did football in football kit, we just accepted swimming as something that is done without anything on. We weren't embarrassed, even for the galas since it's not like there were any outside spectators and the teachers that were there couldn't care less about what we were wearing. We were worried about whether we would win or lose, not about being nude.

I'm sure Bradley you accepted that briefs are the commonly accepted swimming kit, just like we accepted nothing as being the right kit.

Marshall, this is quite shocking to say the least! I remember when I was in school I was selected for a swim competition where my team and I were given these tight swim briefs to wear. Even that was a bit too uncomfortable to be in, can't imagine how bad it must have been to be wearing nothing at all

I'm not quite sure since it was a long time ago but as far as I know the only spectators were the swimming teacher and the team captains, who were also teachers. So there weren't any outside spectators not involved in organising the gala.