Burnley Grammar School

To Dave and Sam, when you say that you had to line up completely naked outside the examination room, were you supervised by teachers or school staff?
Was this in primary or secondary school?

At my Scottish school in the 60's, one of the doctors wanted his boys to be in PE shorts (the other boys could wear trousers and underpants for the other doctors). I forgot mine so a strict prefect ordered me to strip naked. After he'd come and gone to the doctor and other places, I was given the medical. The doctor then took out a Lochgelly tawse from his bag and gave me six strokes.
Later that day, I was summoned by our toughest PE teacher to a punishment training session along with several other boys who had crossed the doctor and prefect. Both were in attendance to witness the session and indeed the doctor suggested ways of making it harder. He then praised my master's belting skills as among the best he'd seen.

Like Sam we did have a medical at the beginning of each school year and we had to line up outside the M.I. room naked.
We were then called in individually for the exam including examining our genitalia.
Again I do recall hearing of a few boys being advised to be circumcised as a result.

We had medical exams very like the ones Sam described, where everyone had to line up bare-chested. I also never understand why I had to take my shirt off just to have my eyes tested! For the rest of the exam you went through to the doctor's room and stripped to your briefs or boxers, then as and when necessary you'd be instructed to pull them down.

Sam you were lucky.
When we had our annual medical we had to line up outside the M.I. room stark naked until called in.
Again why we had to be naked to have our eyes and ears tested was beyond me although in a perverse way it made some sense to be naked to have our penises and testicles inspected!

When we had medicals(usually once a year)we had to line up outside the M.I. room stripped to the waist until called in individually.
Why we had to be bare-chested to have our eyes and ears tested I shall never know although it was obviously necessary for other parts.
Although done privately the most embarrassing part was having to drop our shorts for examination of our penises and testicles.

In reply to Bryan,it was a minor operation done under local anaeshetic was I was six years old.
I understand there are many reasons for this procedure :- religious,a necessary reason to prevent too tight a foreskin,hygiene and simply aesthetic reasons.
It certainly wasn't common practice at my school and boys are naturally inquisitive and were quite intrigued, as I was the odd one out.

I've no idea why it was as it was but I first noticed other boys being circumcised when starting secondary school i.e. about 11 years old.

To Roy, as you have shared that with us do you know why , and how old were you?

When I was at school in the sixties nearly all the boys were circumcised myself included.

Although people say "ouch" when referring to the circumcision of boys, I presume if they had reached puberty it was carried out under a general anaesthetic. Is this correct?

Interesting Bill`s comment re circumcision sometimes resulting as a consequence of school medical examinations.

In the context of communal naked showering at the end of school PE and games lessons (also naked swimming) one obvious (in the case of boys) distinction or difference that was there to be noticed was that some (normally the minority) were in fact circumcised (in the US though they were/are usually the majority).

When I was a boy there were three operations or medical procedures that it was fashionable to perform on boys (often contentiously on account of them not necessarily being medically necessary).These were tonsillectomy,"adenoids",and circumcision (the only one of these that I myself succumbed to was circumcision).

I have read that in the aforementioned shower and swimming situations circumcised boys (in the UK context) were made fun of or were objects of curiosity on account of being "different".Whilst I don`t doubt that this did indeed sometimes happen I have to say that as far as I am concerned personally (and posters may have had a different experience) I have never ever come across anything like this.

Since the BGS photo isn`t too far removed from the time when I was a boy and grammar schools being essentially middle class institutions (circumcision traditionally being favoured by the middle and upper classes) it is perhaps a fair bet that a sizeable minority of the boys pictured would have undergone at least one of the operations or procedures mentioned previously (including circumcision).

To Andrea. I remember a few boys being recommended for circumcision because of a tight foreskin. Ouch!

Yes I imagine that having your nan there would have been embarrassing - I certainly wouldn't have wanted my dad there for mine!

Does anyone recall the doctors finding anything that needed treatment during the tests on their classmates - I certainly can't?

With regards to school medical examinations, I only became worried when, I was about 15. It was an all boys school & the medicals had been held over a few days. The boys who had attended earlier in the week were telling us about how at the end of the check up they had to drop trousers and pants for the cough & drop and foreskin check. My problem was that parents had received letters inviting them to attend(but there was no mention of the intimate part of the check up.) So far no parents had attended and it those days it would be mostly mothers available as they tended to stay at home & dad worked had attended and I was concerned because I lived with my nan and I was horrified that she would feel she needed to come along and if she did she would see my bits.
Luckily, I managed to persuade her that as I was 15 I was old enough to go alone & there was no need for her to attend and she didn't. Just as well because, what the other boys had said would happen was true, and we stood there all our glory showing but at least we were seen individually whereas some boys tried to convince us we had to stand in a line. But it was a female doctor. Who introduced the final part of the exam with "drop your trousers & pants & don't be silly I've seen it so many times before.

To John from Ireland. What was it about your medical inspections which you hated so much?
I only remember one medical inspection in late primary school at about age 10. We had no privacy, it was done in groups in the presence of our female class teachers.

For others who had medical inspections at school, was there any privacy or was it done in front of others?
I know of some schools who required parents or some school staff to be present during the medical exams.

I remember school medicals very well. We had them every year. I was examined in my underpants, and at the end had to drop them, whilst foreskin was checked, and the good old "cough" test. Latterly I had my rectum inspected, but thankfully nothing was inserted. Embarrassing at the time.

I can remember having a couple of school medicals during my time at secondary school in the 1970s.These took place in the school medical room with our school nurse and a visiting doctor.

The first one was during my first year at Secondary School when I was about 11 and a half.
I can remember having to strip down to my vest and knickers and having my height and weight checked by the school nurse. She also checked my hands for warts and feet for verrucas. The doctor then asked me to lift my vest to so he could check my heart and lungs with the stereoscope.

The second medical was when I was about 15. In many ways it was similar to the first, except that by that time I was wearing a bra. I had to unhook it and partially remove it so the doctor could do a quick visual examination of my breasts. I didn't have to remove my knickers, but the nurse did have a quick peek down there and ask if my periods were regular.

We also had visits from time to time by 'Nitty Nora as well as the dreaded BCG injections.

Whilst not from the UK but Ireland this brings me back to my school days. We had to do PE bare chested all through the year and since it was boarding school we had an annual medical inspection which most of us hated.

We had school medical exams right the way from primary school until leaving at eighteen, I think they were every year but certainly at least every two years. At primary school it was in a room with a doctor and a nurse. There was a screen down the middle of the room and on one side you undressed down to underpants and saw the nurse and then when ready and the lad before you had gone went round the screen to the doctor, I can't remember exactly what happened but underpants were certainly down and testicles felt.

At grammar school it was referred to as a medical inspection and they took place in the gym. We went in class by class and lined up. We were told to undress and I can remember the first time we were told that any 'little boys' in the class could keep their underpants on but men should take them off. By that time we were used to taking off underpants for PE and having communal showers at the end and as no one wanted to be seen as a 'little boy' underpants came off. The doctor was an old navy doctor who was brusque and stood no nonsense. We had to line up and he moved his way along the line checking one part of each body at a time so ears, mouths and so on. Testicles were last and everyone had to take a turn to cough. In the last couple of years we also had to bend over and be checked internally by a rough and probing finger.

I am fairly certain we did have physical exams by a travelling school doctor in our secondary (grammar) school. Individually in an office, if I remember correctly, with a queue formed outside the door.
Can't really remember what they checked!
We certainly were checked by the "nit-nurse" in primary school but I am not sure if that carried on into secondary school.

In response to Curious, I am not aware of physical examinations taking place in any British secondary schools: we certainly did not have them. They did take place in our primary school - individually in the staff room, by a doctor working for the County Council. A member of staff was present although parents could attend if they wanted to. They hardly ever did.

I lately watched this documentary on the British Royal Marines and I was surprised to learn that recruits actually have to sleep naked. No boxer shorts or socks allowed and definitely no pyjamas,from 10:20 onward:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGzXJ3pRLQY

What were your school's physical exams like?
Where they done in groups or in privacy?
Were there chaperones, like parents or teachers, present?

I was born in 1946 and raised in central Illinois in the US, so that is my experience.

Our schools did not have pools. We did have PE every day in grades 7-12. We had to wear shorts. and t-shirts. Boys often divided up into teams of "skins" (no shirt) and "shirts." We thought nothing of it and never questioned it.

We learned to swim at the YMCA. In those days Y's were either all men or YWCA's which were all female. Suits were simply NOT allowed in the pool. You had to shower and go through a short hall with access to the pool. This hall had nozzles in the base of the walls to wash your feet and between your legs. Then you went through a final foot bath.

All swimming and lessons were nude. The life guards were mostly high school and college boys and they too wore no suits. Your first day you might have had a little apprehension, but it went away quickly. A pool filled with 30 naked boys of all ages and their dads was considered totally normal.

Some of my fondest memories are of one of our parents dropping a car load of us boys off at the Y on Saturday morning with nothing more than a towel and a dollar for lunch and snacks. We would stay the better part of the day in the pool or gym after our swim lesson.

I can also mention that in school, we were REQUIRED to take a full shower after every PE class. If you got caught skipping your shower you got detention. In those days boys learned to relax in the the presence of other naked boys of all shapes and sizes and thought little of it. You were only really in a rush if you had already dawdled and had to get to class.

Our fathers and other male family members had mostly served in the military during World War II so they fully accepted communal male nudity.

Also, many families had moved from farms in to the city for jobs after the war. My grandparents lived on a small farm in southern Illinois. The cousins, uncles and dads ALWAYS swam in the pond or creek nude. If you had suggested you were going to spend money on clothes to get wet they would have thought you addled. Now the schools don't require communal showering or nude swimming. The result is boys taking "selfies" of their bodies and posting them on the internet.

I think we were more accepting of not only our own bodies but those of others before they merged the Y's and became slightly hysterical bout body parts.

One last note. I have several friends who were raised the same time in Chicago and attended both Catholic and/or public schools. Large schools that had indoor pools. They have all confirmed that nude swimming for males was NOT a matter of choice. No suits, period unless you were on the seim team and in a competiton.

With reference to Curious and his questions about compulsory nude swimming, research I have done suggests that this practice was at one time almost universal, gradually becoming less frequent from the 1960's, and disappearing completely only in the early 1980's, but by then it was very rare indeed.

Winston Churchill records in his autobiography that he and all other boys swam naked at Harrow. At Bedford School nude swimming was compulsory up to the early 1960's but had ended by the time I went there in the 1970's, although I myself saw an old copy of the swimming pool rules which stated that the wearing of swimming trunks was a privilege restricted to sixth formers.

I have friends who are a few years younger than me who swam naked at their respective schools: Newcastle Royal Grammar and Berkhamstead, though both told me the practice was discontinued during their time there. One of them left Berkhamstead in about 1986 and it seems that compulsory nude swimming persisted into the early 1980's, which is unusually late. I think at Berkhamstead it was compulsory for boys of all ages but at Newcastle, as at Bedford in an earlier period, it was only compulsory for junior boys.

I have a friend who attended a Blue Coat school (I think Cheshunt or somewhere like that) who said nude swimming was compulsory for all boys of all ages, but he was there in the 1950's. He told me that no-one thought there was anything odd or unusual about it, and he cannot remember anyone being teased, or being in any way embarrassed; but this was not the experience of my friends in the 1970's and 1980's, for by then they were conscious that they were participating in an archaic tradition.

Manchester Royal Grammar had compulsory nude swimming to quite a late period as well - I think into the early 1980's - so it may have been the last school to abandon what was, 100 years ago, a near universal practice. Summerhill is I think a special case, being an ultra trendy alternative sort of school where nude swimming was (and technically still is) optional, never compulsory, and also mixed - a very different type of place to all the others I have mentioned.

Military school in Asia

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vCP4nmq7mO4

1:45

To "Curious", I did not attend such a school but here is a named reference to a school where it was practiced.

http://www.blokeinthenorth.com/2011/06/i-want-more-dinner-right-now.html

Edward and Matthew, can you name the schools which you were in which had this practice?
I don't think this would be a problem since it was so long ago and thousands of pupils must have gone to those schools.
When did this practice stop, if it did?
Can you produce some document or verification from your school or its website, or any other school official website, to confirm that this was the rule at the time?

Another poster gave a link to the old pupils site of the school he went to where he claims that both boys and girls swam nude together as normal. There is all mention of every trivial thing that happened there in their days by these old pupils, but none mention anything about nude swimming.

So if it was so widespread as some claim why is there no verifiable mention of it anywhere, at least that I know of?

To 'Curious". I would suspect that in the case of schools where naked swimming was the practice, maybe the uniform lists didn't mention trunks. It is also quite possible that new intake pupils were aware of what to expect from having friends or family already at the school.