Burnley Grammar School

TimH & Pipin, My maternal grandmother had rickets in the very early part of the C20th and although I wasn't told this until I was in my teens, I remember when I must have been aged about 7 and my mother asking me when we were outside in the sunshine if I wanted to take my shirt off. She was probably thinking that it would benefit me and help prevent me from getting rickets.I can still remember how good it felt outdoors wearing nothing on top. When I went to grammar school in the mid fifties I had no problem when we had to strip to the waist for P.E.lessons in the gym and outside, including cross country. My parents kept me in short trousers until the January after my 14th birthday, probably so that I could get as much vitamin D. The fashion nowadays, however, is to dress boys in long trousers from a very early age. After I started wearing long trousers to school and my mother saw me wearing them in the garden in the summer she used to tell me to come in and put my shorts on and get the sun and fresh air to my body. So I used to spend a lot of time stripped off soaking up plenty of vitamin D. I do believe that getting us exposed to the sunshine when we were young helped to reduce/eradicate rickets from children and nowadays I try to get out in the sunshine to build up my vitamin D to protect me from winter colds and other ailments.

Replying to Pipin - yes - in the early part of the C20th the state of the 'national health' was not good - there was a conscious move (from all parts of society) to get the country fitter - think of the rambling movement, the start of the YHA, 'Women's League of Health & Beauty', scouting, etc. Rickets was widespread - my father had it in the 1920s - it is caused by a lack of Vitamin D, which you get from an exposure to the sun ... so stripping off on the sun and letting nature do its bit.

Paul - Frank C.
At my school the pool had no space for spectators.Sometimes though the Headmaster's wife and family would be swimming in their costumes whilst we boys were naked. After a short time I became used to not wearing trunks which continued throughout my schooldays.

June,
Much like Anthony I did indoor PE in little more than shorts even by the later eighties, so things hadnt changed much since the 60s/70s many posters refer to.

Hi Paul kindred spirits it seemed!There were the school open days a showcase for prospective pupils and their parents and family members.The best swimmers were selected to display there skills and aptitude in the pool including the twelve to thirteen year olds.Like you we used to the regime and quite enjoyed the free open movement without the restrictive effect of trunks.

I have just watched a television programme showing school days going back in time. The episode was between the wars. There was a sequence which showed an all boys class being taught their normal lessons at their desks in the playground. They had not tops on only grey shows. According to the sound track of the film this was introduced to make sure that they were exposed to plenty of vitamin d from the sun,because rickets was common at that time. So I wonder whether the rules for being stripped to the waist for P.E. and games followed on from that idea.

Robbie,interesting that although your kit listed a vest your teacher(s) made you strip off outside,and in the winter too. A vest isn't much but it's better than nothing. How did you cope with the temperatures, was this commonplace in UK schools?

To Edward, Frank and others who were made to swim naked at school,

At my prep school in the 70s we had the same rule, not allowed to wear anything for swim classes.
It was not such a big deal since we were all boys and actually enjoyed it. But there was some embarrassment during swimming galas when we also had to be naked in front of parents, sisters and other relatives and guests, some of them women and girls our age.
The younger boys up to 10 or 11 didn't seem to mind, but at 12-13 it was somewhat embarrassing.
Did you also have swimming galas at your schools in front of mixed spectators?

Hi Gary Though our outdoor kit comprised of a pale blue vest. In reality we were made to strip off to the waist as we did indoors, and regardless of the weather. We had 2 double and 2 single lessons each week.

Anthony
You mentioned you went to school in the 80s, and, therefore, i am intrigued as to what clothing you wore for outdoor sport. One also hears that today youngsters shower in their underwear or go home to shower! Was that your experience? What sort of school did you atttend etc.?

Yes we did pe indoors in just shorts and barefeet that was in early 1980s
I don't think it did us any arm at all

Hi John

Indoors I was fine with stripped to the waist/bare feet.

Outdoors I think most boys would have liked to have been allowed to wear a top. As you will guess there was no debate, we did as we were told, or came back from the run to face a caning.

Hi Gary,
Your PE kit rule was the same that I had in the 1970s. Would you have preferred to have been able to wear a vest or t shirt for indoor PE and cross country or did you get used to wearing only shorts and come to like it?

My school was normal for the time (early 70's), indoor PE in shorts only, cross country shorts/plimsolls, stripped to the waist. We had 2 PE lessons a week, one inside, one cross country, so we ran all year around.

At the start of the 2nd year we had a lad move to the school, because his parents moved jobs. He was used to wearing much more kit, and was shocked on a frezzing cold day to be told he had to run minus his rugby shirt or vest, and in only his shorts.

Further to earlier comments I recollect swimming without trunks at a boy's private school in the 1950s. I was reticent at first and wore trunks. I was soon ordered to strip off. I never dared wear them again swimming naked thereafter taking only my towel to the pool.

Stuart was bang on the money by stating that our parents were aware of the no trunks rule at the prep school mine from 8 to 13 just a clean towel to pack each week.Agreed the maturing issue could be problematic for some especially if they were self-conscious of their physique .

Toby P, Just as John said, we boys were worked hard and always sweated profusely. I used to enjoy feeling the sweat running down my whole body and glad that I was only wearing PE shorts. We all used to look forward to taking our shorts off and getting under the showers to freshen up afterwards and had no problem about being in the nude together either.

Ben
I agree with all that you have written and as you state about showering at swimming pools, I to notice that youngsters shower in their swimwear. It is the modern society we have to blame. Sadly, the time has now come when I also keep my trunks on when showering at the swimming pool (certainly if there are younger people in the area) for fear of comments from other people about being naked in a male changing area.

Ivor, Pipin,

At my all boys prep school we had an indoor heated pool and we all swam naked from age 9. Most boys were perfectly happy with it certainly early on. Once puberty kicked in for some it was more awkward as they developed ealrier, but I found it probably more embarssing by the fact that I dveleoped late and by the time we left the prep school I was still a "boy" and most of my classmates were not. Havings aid all that back then we never thought of questioning what was a given - you swam naked, you shwoered naked afte pe and games and did as you were told. this was the early to mid 70s in the UK. Our parnets knew and accepted it as they snet us to school with just a towel.
The only times I recall females being present was when the Head was showing prospective parents around and ther annual house swim gala when the very few female members of staff were there.

Toby P,
That never happened to myself or other lads because we always sweated profusely as we were worked hard. Shorts only for PE made total sense and was healthy, such a well thought out PE rule should still be the order of the day. As other people have commented there’s no problem as a lad doing PE shirtless even if PE sessions are mixed sex.

My last post should have read,I felt ludicrous wearing short trousers when most of my contemporaries"were" wearing long trousers.

I don't know about others but if we weren't sweating freely down our bare tops at the end of the lesson you went back to the gym after school and do the whole lesson again.

Hi Fiona, Indeed! We do come out of things well. Fashion has benefited us a lot more than men. Buying something straightforward for boys can be difficult and most shops cater for females.

I also don't see what the fuss is all about with boys doing PE topless in just shorts, even if it is a mixed PE class.
After all that is the way all boys and men are on public beaches and swimminhg pools and no one seems to be bothered about it.
Unfortunately our liberal 'politically correct' modern society imposed on us this ridiculous mentality among other things.
Many schools, including the primary one in my town, make both boys and girls do PE in tracksuit long pants so as not to even show their legs, which is pure insanity if you ask me.
Many schools, probably most, have also done away with showers after PE, for the same reasons.
I have also noticed in the last 15 years or so that boys and youths shower in their swimsuits at my local public swimming pool. Gone are the days when we had more freedom and less to worry about when I was a boy growing up.

Fiona, I agree with you as I have posted previously ladies can wear thong bikinis by the pool or on the beach but "speedo" type swim briefs are a no no for men especially in the UK. Although abroad the local men are not so inhibited.

Fiona and John, I'm certainly glad that since retiring I no longer have to wear a suit and tie especially in the hot weather which we experienced last summer.As one who was encouraged by my parents when I was young to get the sun and fresh air to my body and always had to strip to the waist for PE both in the gym and outside, including running cross country, I agree that it is wrong to prevent males from doing what comes naturally because of some ridiculous equality campaign. Little wonder nowadays in the summer that men prefer to wear shorts all the time whenever they can; lets hope they don't start a campaign against the wearing of them or there will be nothing men can do! In the meantime I will continue to take my shirt off when I am working in the garden, which meets with my wife's approval, or washing the car on the drive, which does not, because she says I am too old!

Whatever anyone says, men and women should be able to feel comfortable about their bodies and this begins when they are young through encouragement from parents showing their children that there is nothing wrong in allowing the fresh air to get their bodies, and continues at school including the stripped to the waist rule for lads PE which made complete sense and should never have been stopped.

Pipin,"there was no regulation"at the school that I attended as to whether boys should wear short trousers or longs.
My parents also took the decision to keep me in shorts into my late teens and I felt ludicrous wearing shorts when most of my contemporaries wear wearing long trousers.

Rachael- yes, there are things that males can do, eg go topless in certain, generally sporting, situations, that we females can't, but there is also a lot more that we can do that they can't. Think formal dress, we can be bare-shouldered while our partners need to wear suits and ties. Or more informally in the Summer, a strappy vest or crop top is acceptable almost anywhere for us, but there is no equivalent for the boys, and full topless is usually taboo except at the beach/pool. And what about thong bikinis?

Hi Rachael and John, Boys at my school wore vests from the changing rooms to the gym or onto the field or yard. Once they lined up then they stripped off. I'm pretty sure their teachers were ex Army.

Rachael,
I totally agree with you. Men and women are different, both sexes deserve to be treated with respect and fairness. It’s wrong to prevent males from doing what comes naturally, most lads on a hot day would feel more comfortable playing sports shirtless but are being prevented from taking off their shirts because of some ridiculous ‘equality’ campaign.

The stripped to the waist rule for lads PE made complete sense, if you’re going to get too hot and sweaty exercising there’s no point in putting on a shirt in the first place. I feel sorry for lads growing up now.