Burnley Grammar School

The recent discussion has highlighted the change in attitude between now and 50 years ago towards nudity in single sex schools. We had communal showers at school after gym and were told to get on with it as we were all boys together and there was no reason to be embarrassed. Most of us quickly stopped being shy about being nude. I never saw a master behave improperly in any way.

Will McBride famously photographed the boys washing at Salem School in 1963. Germany has always been more relaxed about nudity than Britain; but the US was more like us and there the change in attitude has been equally striking. In Life magazine dated 13 Jan 1941 there is an article on Democracy in US Schools which includes a photo of about 20 boys back view in a communal shower. Life was a mainstream magazine widely available on US news stands and the photo was uncontroversial. Very different from today's attitudes.

As this is a history site I thought referring to a couple of primary sources would be interesting.

Gerald, I'm not the one you asked but I can say that it is an anomaly. Very very few schools still have compulsory showers, especially nude. It's a shame because the area covered by swimwear is one of the places most prone to infection.

Gerald, it was an anomaly as none of my friends from other schools had the policy of compulsory showers after swimming. I'm glad that this is a rare case, more and more schools are realising that showers are better done in the privacy of one's own home rather than in front of your classmates.

Louise, my wife told me that at the mixed school she attended in the 60's the girls PE kit was white shorts and polo shirts. After every PE lesson they all had to go naked in the communal showers unless they were having their period when they were excused showers. No doubt this quite normal for girls at that time and you probably didn't have to take showers at your school. At the boys school I attended, we wore just shorts and plimsolls and nothing else and of course there was no excuse for anyone not going naked in the showers afterwards.

T, thank you for the response. So it seems that even today schools still allow for nude showers. Was this the case at other schools do you think or was your school an anomaly?

I've read most of the comments and a lot of people are surprised that girls used to have to do PE in their underwear or even just their knickers, but a lot of these messages relate to lessons in the early 1990s and earlier.

I'm 24 and went to an all girls school from the ages of 11-18. When I was in year seven in 2004 we did indoor PE twice a week and we didn't have PE kit. We all had to just strip down to our knickers and do the lesson like that. It was embarrassing to start with and it was cold in the winter! From year eight onwards we got a kit to wear but it was a pair of tiny gym knickers and a thin cotton vest, always with bare feet. If we forgot our kit then it was back to doing it in our underwear!

Daryl, I agree with your point that showering is important. After swimming, showers were compulsory at my school. Most of us did take our swimwear off before hitting the showers. Since the showers were communal, you can understand why some might have preferred to keep their swimwear on, however the rules were that swimwear should not be worn in the showers.

T, thanks for your answer. Was showering done with or without trunks? And did you have to shower after PE or just after swimming?

In my day, if you even considered not showering you were given the slipper and made to shower. It's just not hygienic to go from high octane exercise to a lesson without having washed yourself. T, did your school have showers? And was it compulsory to shower?

Gerald, at my school, the sports we played were football, basketball, rugby, cross country, gymnastics and athletics.
There was compulsory showers after swimming but not after PE.
It is a state-run boys only school.

T, were there showers after PE or did you not have them?
Also, what sports did you play during your time at the school? And was this at a private or state run school?

T thank you for your response. Your comments re underwear show how times have changed since I was at an all boys school from 1961 to 1966

Yes we wore our normal underwear under our shorts. All our kit was bought from a supplier so everyone wore the same kit.

T it is interesting to read comments from a person who has recently left school. For PE were you allowed to wear pants under your shorts or like us from older generation was underwear banned? The fact that you wore swimming briefs in the pool is interesting but I assume that was the rules, because one rarely sees males wearing swimming briefs in public these days

At my school, we did PE in shorts and a t-shirt. For team games, we would use different bibs and for colder days, such as for cross country, we wore jumpers. I finished school last year so this is quite an accurate representation. For swimming, we wore swim briefs.

In response to Willy.

Swimming lessons were in an indoor pool not large enough for spectators with a male supervising master.

Edward, can you describe how the swimming sessions were carried out?
Were they swimming lessons or free swims?
Did you have swimming competitions or galas in front of spectators?
Also were female teachers or staff ever present during your nude swims?

In response to Willy.

I attended a boy's only Preparatory/Public School.

Swimming without trunks was obligatory for all.

Edward, could you elaborate and clarify further, was it a primary, prep or secondary school?
Was it a boys only or mixed school?

Further to recent comments tradition was not the pretext to swimming naked at the school that I attended in the early sixties.The regime was imposed at the whim of the Headmaster.

'Get used to it' was the response from other staff.

Participating nude was initially daunting, but I became accustomed to it, with the added benefit of no wet trunks.

In response to your comments Willy, I think you are correct. It was either school or district policy that governed rules on nude swimming. We had weekly swimming lessons at our secondary school but we were taken b y coach to the local municipal pool. It was a session just for our school which all boys but swimming trunks were worn. For PE it was like most schools shorts no pants or top and plimsolls only no socks. Our parents knew this and no one thought anything about it.

I expect at the first lesson I thought it strange and felt a bit uncomfortable but I knew what was coming because my elder brother was already attending the school and he had told me about the minimal clothing in PE and I know he tried to tease me by saying that with no pants and only shorts everything would hangout. In spite of everything we all survived.

In answer to the question about dress for PE today I know from my son's high school ti is shorts for outdoor football etc. although winter he can wear track suit bottoms and they always wear a top and underwear. There is no mention of showers and he does not have to take a towel. It seems from what he says several PE and sports lessons are spent talking about the theory of keeping fit with very little exertion

It was not teachers that made boys swim nude. It was either the school policy or district policy.
If it was illegal it would never have happened anywhere.
The main reason was tradition and the culture of the time. In fact most all parents of the time accepted it as normal and never objected.
It was the same with PE kit of shorts only or underpants unly, or even supervised communal showers at school, all of which would be seen as unacceptable today.
I guess the only tradition from among these that still survives today, though probably getting rarer, is the compulsary communal shower after PE.
Does anyone here know of any schools which still have any of these old traditions?

I never minded nude swimming once we got used to the idea. Equally communal showers were quite healthy places where there was always a bit of chat and banter which was much more fun that the closed cubicles of today.

It's always a mistake to judge other times by values of a different age. I certainly never met a teacher who seemed to have any untoward intentions, no doubt a very few did but it's so wrong to judge the majority on the basis of that.

Why did they insist on nude swimming? Why shouldn't people wear trunks? I honestly think these teachers should be tried- they may have had some wrong intentions... absolutely awful that this happened.

Lewis, what you said about France is true for a lot of mainland Europe. When I lived in Germany, it was the norm to wear speedos if you were a guy and a bikini if you're a woman. The hygiene reason is often touted as for why this the case, although for women I don't quite believe that a bikini would be more 'hygienic', not to complain though!

Sterling
I have read quite recently that on the continent (especially France) swimming shorts are not allowed in swimming pools particularly at hotels, and males all have to wear swimming trunks of the briefs design. (speedos). Apparently the reason for this is also "fibres from shorts clog the filtration system" In addition I have read that men might wear swimming shorts on the beach and if they go into the pool without changing then sane from the beach can also clog the system.

However, I cannot see how schools in the past used clogging as an excuse to insist on nude swimming.

One excuse adopted by School Authorities for mandating nude swimming was the alleged dire problem of what to do with wet trunks!

The Plastic bag was only invented in the early 60's and not widely available until later in the decade.

However in mixed Schools girls were permitted swimsuits with three times the material of swim trunks.
This also draws into question the other reason widely given for the enforcement of suit-free swimming for boys only.
That the fibres from their trunks clogged the filtration systems!
If that was the case surely girls' suits would have the same effect?

Certainly odd but I can see why it was necessary. You can't really clean yourself properly if you're wearing trunks. It was very daunting walking to and from the showers but actual being in the shower room without trunks was perfectly fine.

I understand what you mean about the win briefs. It depends on the competition. For a lot of individual events, I wore my jammers as that's what I find the best personally. But for team events we wore our team kit which was blue swim briefs. It depends on the competition.

Bradley, it's interesting to see that nude showering happens in some schools. At my school we showered with trunks on. What was it like?

And did you wear trunks for competitions as well? At a gala I took part in everyone wears swim briefs

Gerald, teachers weren't allowed to enter the shower area, yes. But after a swimming lesson we would go to the changing area, take off our trunks and make our way to the shower room. He would have been able to see if someone immediately got changed without having a shower since he's usually just outside the changing room so can see when everyone leaves after getting dressed. But everyone did shower, there was never a time when someone tried to avoid it.