Burnley Grammar School

The comments about conditions at home in winter time certainly brought back a few chilly memories!
Another couple of things I remember about the winters are the smell of the small paraffin heater used in our downstairs toilet to stop the pipes freezing overnight and also that occasionally if milk bottles were left outside too long the milk would sometimes freeze and 'pop' the foil cap on the bottle.

On a more general note, I remember my younger sister and I having to use the same bathwater to save heating another tankful. I used to think it unfair that she always got to have first go. Mind you she would probably say that it evened things up for the fact that quite often she had to wear clothes I had outgrown!

I can also remember how popular one of my friends suddenly became when her parents were the first in our street to get a colour TV!

Well Rob, regarding your comments, I think I understand what the teacher was trying to do to prevent futher tomfoolery. Was it effective? The thought of being "invited" to touch another boy seems odd, something that would not happen nowadays. But of course this would have been a completely different era. Was it the 50's or 60's?

In reply to Bill. Nude swimming was a shock at first, but one reluctantly had to get used to it, and it continued until leaving school.No excuse was tolerated. Supervision was by male teachers. In any competitions, if the competing school wore trunks, then we would wear trunks also. Inter house school competitions would be strictly without trunks.

I recall that during PE in the gym boys would often grab at each others shorts and pull them down if they thought no one was looking. I was often picked on, and slapped or kicked in the crotch, maybe because I was an early developer in that area.

The PE teacher evidently decided we were taking too much notice of other boys' masculinity. One day we were formed into groups of ten or so, and made to stand shoulder to shoulder in a circle. He told us to lower our shorts to our knees and study each others genitalia. I resisted initially but had to comply, no doubt with a red face. We were then invited to touch the boy to our right. All this was apparently intended to make us feel less embarrassed about our naked bodies in future, enabling us to concentrate on the physical excercises and sporting activities.

Edward, what was the compulsary nude swimming like and up to what age?
Did you ever have female spectators like teachers or school staff or swimming galas?
From what several posters on this forum and other sites say this custom of compulsary nude swimming for boys seems to have been more common and widespread than I thought.
It also seems to have been more common in the north of England and the Midlands. I lived in the south, in the London area and didn't know of any schools which had this practice. Maybe it was more common in private schools. Most public schools didn't have a pool anyway.
I wonder if there are still any schools which still have this practice of compulsary nude swimming.

Regarding the spartan conditions at school endured by most pupils 50 or 60 years ago, it is worth remembering that in those times our homes were pretty uncomfortable too, by modern standards.

With no central heating, my home had only the main living room that was heated, from a coal fire, in Winter. Every other room, apart from occasionally the kitchen, was virtually a 'no-go' area owing to the bitter cold.

Each Winter evening my family gathered around the hearth in the living room, listening to the radio or watching the flickering 12" black & white TV screen. I would be doing my homework seated at the table at the other side of the room, but taking my time because I was usually sent to bed as soon as I had finished it.

Bedrooms were only used for sleeping in. Windows were large and single glazed and the lucky ones took a hot water bottle to bed to warm up the icy cold sheets. By morning the whole house was freezing cold with frosty 'fern patterns' on the insides of bedroom windows.

We expected nothing else during Winter and were well accustomed to those conditions, so we didn't feel disadvantaged. Complaints were rare and ignored anyway.

No comment about the transparency of shorts would have arisen at the all boys school that I attended many decades ago now, since swimming naked was compulsory, as were communal showers. There was also a strictly enforced no underpants rule for all sports, all unquestioned at the time.

We had lengthy cross country runs with the route taking us through villages,lanes and main roads.
I do recall some rude comments being made and also some tooting of car horns.This led further to our embarrassment and humiliation when having to wear our almost transparent shorts.
Ironically we were told to behave and treat people with respect when out of school grounds and not to bring disgrace on the school.

Actually I really don't remember any comments but it was on the edge of the town so there was only a short bit housing to run past. The rest was woodland and rural roads.
Although I say run, I was more likely to be wondering along taking short cuts!

James, did you ever get comments from the public or passers by when you had to go through town streets on country runs in just those skimpy transparent shorts that you mention?

Fortunately at my school we wore the older type thicker material shorts and vests for PE, and we never went for cross country runs.

It wasn't just the material that I found the shorts unsuitable but the way they were cut into very skimpy shorts.
I certainly didn't turn my shorts up as others have said but I was forever trying to pull them down slightly.

The comments by James regarding the embarrassment / discomfort felt by his 'early developer' classmate and the teasing by his friends had it's parallels for some girls too. Although I remained flat chested until after I had left Primary School, a few of my classmates started to 'develop' during our last year there. Of course it was during PE that this was most noticeable. If they hadn't yet started to wear a bra, then the movement became evident (and commented on) and if they had, the outline could be seen underneath their T shirts, leading to teasing and occasional strap twanging from some of the more annoying boys!

The comment from Tim regarding rolling the waistband over to make his shorts shorter also had it's parallels, with some girls doing this with their skirts!

Well thought out comments from James, especially the one that 'The shorts went almost totally transparent but we just seemed to assume that's the way it was and not take any notice.'

Starting my Grammar School in 1960 my gym shorts were white, quite baggy and with just a single strand of elastic at the waist (not elasticated). Built to last, rather than for style, they lasted several years. By the mid 60s shorts were becoming (a lot) shorter and those of us still left with longer ones found ourselves rolling the waist over a couple of times to make them shorter - a thing which some youngsters are now doing with their longer shorts.

Eventually they wore out and I got some white cotton shorts by Umbro.

James,
I remember wearing those shorts similar to the ones you described for the first time.We were only allowed three minutes to change so I had no time to dawdle but what alarmed was one of the boys who had who had slipped his skimpy shorts on was that his buttocks were clearly outlined through the translucent material.I thought surely we wouldn't have to go out wearing these shorts but I was mistaken we had to go on a cross country run.
We certainly weren't allowed to wear any underwear under the shorts and would have clearly been seen through the thin material or would have protruded below the hem.
They were certainly more transparent when wet but on a cold winter's day I was so cold wearing them I thought I would freeze.

I attended an all boys grammar school in the midlands in the mid 60's. I well remember the scenes set in these comments. The photo looks very similar to our gym lessons.
We had to wear the almost transparent white nylon shorts and we were ordered not to wear underpants. Shirts and skins was the norm for any activity in the gym. Showers were compulsory and we had to go into the communal shower naked.
We were lucky enough to have a pool and it was quite common after a PE session in the gym to have a shower, put our shorts back on and then go into the pool. The shorts went almost totally transparent but we just seemed to assume that's the way it was and not take any notice.
The first time I can remember this being a problem for any of us was one friend who was obviously an early developer started to have problems with hanging out of his shorts. He was embarrassed and of course the rest of us made a huge joke of it, not thinking it would become a problem for us in time!
I remember one day at the beginning of the lesson, the PE teacher sat us down in the changing rooms and talked to us about growing up and that if we felt uncomfortable in just our shorts, we should get jockstraps like the older boys, and in any case we would need them if we were going to play rugby. He had them on sale at school if we wanted to buy them.
Few of us knew what a jockstrap was but as the changing rooms were a shortcut to one part of the school we started to notice older boys getting changed and worked out what they were. Those with older brothers also knew already.
From then on, they started to appear at changing time and, of course they were plainly visible through the almost transparent shorts, especially when we went on to swimming after pe. Often the waistband showed above and the leg straps showed below but, to us, that was a sign of being one of the older boys.
Coming from a family with no older brothers, I had never talked about such things with my parents and they were not at all sporty. I couldn't imagine asking them to get to buy me a jockstrap so I summoned the courage to go and buy one at school. I just remember feeling like one of the big boys and never worried about it showing through the shorts. Like a lot of the others we washed them in the showers and kept them in our lockers.
I was never over sporty so didn't get onto the major teams but we did have to do "cross country running" which took us through the woods but also along public roads. An interesting sight for some passers by, I expect, on a wet day when things had gone particularly transparent!

We boys were made to stand in a line shoulder to shoulder. We were told to look at the wall bars opposite. The PE teacher would then walk in front of us, pausing to pull the shorts to the side, then proceed to the next one. The penalty for not looking at the wall bars was never disclosed but we were told it would be severe.
There were no showers in the changing rooms.
Is there any interest in punishments dealt out by other sadists? Sorry, I meant teachers at that school.

As Speedy writes, it almost beggars belief what Harry wrote, although it was a different era. I know from my schooldays in the mid 60's punishment was severe compared to today, (including the cane across the hand as punishment for misbehaving in other lessons) but you did not go home & complain because to do so incurred the wrath of your parents which was worse. Some boys took the option of the cane rather than stay behind in detention so that their parents did not know that they had been punished. Teachers were to be obeyed end of.

As for checking for pants. How did he do that? That does seem a step to far even in those days. The nearest we came to being checked was the threat at our first pe lesson by the teacher that he would pick a boy at random to bend over. We wore thin white shorts so any pants would be visible so there was no opportunity to flout the rule. The same teacher threatened that if one boy was caught wearing pants the whole class would be get the slipper. That threat was enough.

Interesting comments Harry.What you describe almost beggars belief.But,as you say,it was the 1950s - it was a different world back then.

I almost hesitate to ask what the arrangements were (if any) for showering at the end of your PE lessons.

I went to an all boys school in the late 50s. PE was done in shorts and plimsolls only. The gym master checked to ensure we were not wearing undies. The penalty was to take your undies off in front of every one or receive a slippering. Slipperings were dealt out for being last in a race or otherwise under performing. Slipperings were given at the end of lessons. Plimsolls were removed so that he had something to hit you with, and shorts were removed so that he was not wasting his effort getting through clothing.
A pupil was made to bend over a vaulting block and put his feet into the hand holes of the vaulting block so his legs were apart. That is if the pupil was lucky. The alternative position was the diaper position on top of the vaulting block. I will leave to your imagination where he put a hand to give you protection. But this was the late 1950s.

Re Bill's comment, I recall doing PE just in underwear in a mixed sex infants school 1967-69. This was only in the Infants School, however (ages 5-7); after that we moved along to the Primary school (on the same site) and although my recollection of gym there is a bit hazy, I am pretty sure that we had to wear more than just underpants.

At age 11 I went to an all boys Prep school, and there we had to wear a similar uniform to the one shown here - white nylon shorts with underpants strictly forbidden, plimsolls and white socks, and white cotton vests. For some activities we removed the plimsolls, socks and vests (but never the shorts, thank goodness!)

Mark,my mother would only resort to using corporal punishment only if we misbehaved,were disobedient or did badly with our exams but perversely we were made to wear shorts for her own amusement and gratification.

For PE we always wore white shorts and white teeshirt, both in primary and secondary for both boys and girls.
However I did read that in some primary schools PE was done in just underpants for both boys and girls. How common was this? Did anyone here have this practice at their school?

Also, was it common practice in secondary schools for boys and girls to do PE separately or mixed?
Is the picture on this page from a boys only school, or did the boys have separate PE classes from the girls?

Regarding the comments by Chris and Anon about vests: growing up in the 1960's most of us used to wear them (as far as I can remember from changing for PE at Primary School). I don't recall them being scratchy as they were cotton. The boys ones were normally plain white and the girls were similar, but with perhaps a little coloured bow or similar on the neckline.

I must admit that at the height of summer I did sometimes leave mine off!
I continued to wear a vest into Secondary School, until eventually my developing figure necessitated a different form of underwear!

Yes John I can relate to having my legs smacked. As we got older, mum would have us touch our toes or bend over the arm of the sofa, but the always used to have us pull down our shorts and pants before she took the strap to us!!

Mark,I do agree it was far better not to argue with my mother although the prospect of 'a trip across her knee'might have been a little daunting for her especially if my shorts had to be removed.
I'm sure it was more convenient and practical to award a summary punishment to a refractory teenager by some sharp slaps on my legs.
The brief shorts that I had to wear were ideal to facilitate this form of punishment.

Re Chris's comments about vests. I was brought up by my nan so my fashion was dictated by what the "previous generation" dictated should be worn and was acceptable. It was Vests certainly had to be worn (thick scratchy wooly ones in the winter) right up to my late teens. After starting work I did in fact decide to coose my own clothes and went out and bought the string briefs and vests which were in fashion in the 70's which received a frosty reception from Nan but from then on I chose what I wanted. As previous people have commented, I also wore grey shorts, (which were short )up until I was about 14 because I was deemed not tall enough or old enough for longs. Again Nans influence

With reference to Jamie's comments, similarly we had after school activities and our's was cross country and like wise 2 or 3 of us aged about 12/ 13 would be allowed supervised showers afterwards and we thought nothing about Sir being there and frankly no one cared. There was no hint of any impropriety and as lads we did not care about using communal showers. That's as it was.

Yes John, same here. Arguing too much with mum would earn a trip over her knee. Usually it was best to say nothing.

For normal gym lessons we had no time for showers at the end of lessons. However, sometimes a couple of us had extra gym after school, ie gymnastics etc. We would always be allowed to have showers supervised by the gym teacher. We were only about 12 or 13 so very innocent and it was fun times. No inhibitions in those days. And for gym, we only ever wore gym shorts and no top

For ordinary PE in the gym, or outside on lawn when the weather was particularly fine, showers didn't enter into the picture. After PE, you had no more than ten minutes to get changed and on to the next class. The only time we had showers after exercise was after football on Wednesday and Saturday afternoons.

Very interesting comments you made Chris on the nature of the clothing worn for PE and the similarity of Mr.Parry`s gymn to yours.

Expanding the comparison I wonder what the arrangements were (if any) for showering at the end of your PE lessons. - Interesting to hear(indeed from other posters as well)of any pertinent anecdotes,etc.,and how you felt about it all.